That may be true for you but it's not true for many people, like me.

I have twenty years of iPhone data, eg messages, apps, etc. I can't easily move to some other phone.

A desktop, maybe, but I'd still have to repurchase or find alternates to a bunch of software. It is far, far better if the existing system _stays useful_.

>It is far, far better if the existing system _stays useful_

I doubt anyone is arguing the opposite. The point of the parent is that the system staying useful and not turning hostile on your usecase is not under your control or something you can personally prevent, and until that magically changes it's best to structure your use case to be least affected by things not in your control.

"twenty years"? Wasn't the iPhone released in 2007?

I think rounding over 18 years up to 20 is reasonable.

I've used my past several Android phones without signing into a Google account or using gapps. I pick something with LineageOS support (usually OnePlus stuff) and get it from eBay, update to latest stock firmware (gets newer baseband and such) then flash LineageOS over it and get my apps from F-Droid.

These, “just change the firmware” comments are silly. I should get basic phone functionality from my phone out of the box with exactly ZERO effort.

I can use an iPhone without an Apple account. I cannot use an Android phone without a Google account unless they changed that in the last few years.

Both Android and iphones require an account to download apps I believe. Am I mistaken here? Other than that they can be used in the same way without accounts. In fact, with Android an email account suffices and giving your phone number is "opt-in". Apple forces you to give your phone number to create an account last time I checked. Also no F-droid on iphones? But the iphone is the better "phone" experience because there is less bloat and UI nagging.

Android does not require an account to download apps, as grandparent pointed out.

I haven't "signed in" to Android phone in 10 years.

This has not been my experience. All the Android phones I've tried have forced me to sign in whenever I've opened the Play Store, it wouldn't let me continue without doing so.

There is no need to use the play store.

I think his point is that you don't need the Play Store at all. There are plenty of alternative sources where you can just download APK without ever having to login.

Good luck doing that with iOS. I'm an iPhone user since the very first one and I think the control they have on app install/management is completely bonkers. The app store even sucks for keeping track of what your purchased/care about efficiently.

There’s a real monopoly issue here.

I just switched to iPhone and saw EU has forced apple to allow third party app stores. No such luck for those elsewhere.

The other aspect with setting up third party firmware as a general "don't like the stock OS? then do this" option for many is besides the big headline limitations like safetynet/attestation, it also either involves a benevolent third party setting up and maintaining builds for your device (hope you bought a popular model) and any changes match what you want, or individuals doing so themselves

You can, but you don't get access to the app store.

You absolutely can use Android without a Google account. I have a device like that currently. You won't get the play store and some other features, but I believe that is also true of Apple (at least was of it isn't any more)

I have a low opinion of "out of the box" experiences when it comes to pre-installed software. Phones, routers, PCs. They come loaded with crap that is best blown away.

When I get the phone and update the stock OS before wiping it, I don't need to sign into a Google account then, either, and I don't recall it being signed into someone else's, so I don't think regular Android requires it either, though my exposure is minimal so I can't guarantee it. It will try to have you sign in during the setup wizard, but I believe you can hit skip. You may need to skip connecting to the internet first to skip the account thing, I don't know. Maybe best done before you put the SIM in on top of that.

... That's theft protection, and iphones have similar mechanisms. You do not need to sign in, even to a pixel, to use it. Granted you won't get the app store, but you don't get that on iphone either.

What are you going to do with all your Mac hardware?

Throw it in the bin?

Doesn’t your hardware lock you in?

What? I can and have accessed everything I need on Linux. If you make sure none of your data is locked in, the hardware is just a computer. Absolute worst case, get a new computer.

No. You can always export your files and your passwords etc.